Bentinho Massaro

Written By Jenna Gurka

the “tech bro guru”

Bentino Massaro leveraged the internet to grow a devout following. His teachings are a spiritual circle jerk of nonsense that has led to one death and a trail of sexual assault allegations. 

  • Honestly, I'm gonna I'm gonna tell you what call this one? All roads lead back to a circle jerk. All roads lead back to circle jerk audacity. The audacity? The audacity of a mental circle jerk.

    Jerk. Circle jerk. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

    Wait. Are we recording? Well, now I am. Oh, okay. Cool.

    No. But, like, the ADHD is so strong that, like, I'm zone. I'm in the zone, and, like, the like, littlest thing will throw me off. And then I have to start back from the beginning. So Aldridge would come over, and he'd, like yes.

    Literally, yesterday, he came over, and I could sense his presence getting closer to me already fucking mad already. And then he he comes and he just kisses me on the forehead, like, wherever, this spot right here. And I look up at him, and I'm like, I'm just gonna need you to not interrupt me just one more time. I was like, I just I need to be able to do this, and the kids are doing this. You're doing this.

    I'm in like, pretend that there's walls around me and that I'm not here. I can't even be in this. If he walks into the room, I'm literally. I'm like, I have earrings my floor. I have, like, like, noise cancelling earbuds even.

    And it works so like, for the kids until people come to me. I'm like, why are people coming to me? Just stop. Don't come to me. Like, I'm not here.

    I don't exist. I don't exist. You know what the fucked up part is? Aldridge works 5 minutes a day, and I'm having to work the full day. I mean, working overtime right now.

    Mhmm. And the kids still come to me. And, like, your dad's sitting behind me playing video games. You don't wanna interrupt him. Yeah.

    He's right there. Jack, I think I spent Thursday. Him and Tommy were playing on the switch, and he was like, I'm hungry, mom. Will you get me water? Or, like, can I get something?

    Can you give me a snack? You know what? Tommy doesn't say. It's the winter break at all. I'm here.

    Let me do that. He doesn't go for the interception. I say, I'm a bunch of shit. And then he goes, oh, yeah. I've literally looked at my kids and I'm like, no.

    You don't think you can ask your dad that? Also, you can't go and get your son's mask. Bitch, you are 10 years old. Yeah. You are close to 70 years old.

    I've seen you scale the refrigerator Okay. To get all the things. I'm telling you. Me. Yeah.

    Tell me that you don't know how to throw a fucking pizza in the microwave. Yeah. Tell me that. You can't put a waffle in the toaster? Get the fuck out of here.

    Do you know that Jaimo was asking me where his sweater was? Okay. So when we went to PB okay. So hold on. For let's dial it back for a long ways because we haven't talked to anybody.

    5 minutes in. Okay. Should we, like, start? Because I need to, like, talk about Okay. Yeah.

    Okay. So, how have you been? Struggle bus. Struggle bus. I'm in struggle bus because the holidays fucked me up.

    Okay. I don't know that anybody gets to go through the holidays unscathed. However, I think this year was especially tough. Yeah. Yeah.

    Yeah. I don't know what it was, but the whole vibe of I feel like we were just really busy. We were really busy. I also think it's like the family of it all and, like, navigating the families Family. And navigating the children and navigating the children being out of school, and just fucking up my mental load in such a way.

    Yeah. And then there's the internal struggle of, like, I need a minute, but is this too much screen time? Honestly, I have been living for first of all, living for screen time? No. But what?

    No. My kids have definitely had their fair share of screen time, but I have been living for, J Mo, is your watch charged? Yeah. Get out. And he's been going down to the park.

    He's been taking his little brother. They've been surviving and coming back home. So that's a real nineties level, like, style parenting. That's where I'm try that's what I'm trying to do. I will just go go out there, be one with nature, make choices that I'm not there to help them make, and, you know, they keep making it back home.

    There's this book called The Anxious Generation. I've not read it. Is it about me? No. It's about kids and basically, like, because they aren't it's not like a comeback when the lights are on when the street lights come on situation anymore.

    Uh-huh. Kids don't have this, like, interaction They literally don't. Like, with their peers in which they're able to, like, problem solve without a parent looking at them or, like, judging them or giving them feedback. And, it's on my it's on my Audible, like, thing. I'm not gonna, like, read it, but I'll listen to it.

    So that's, I think, also my 2025 is I'm, like, fuck reading anymore because I always say I'm gonna do it. No. Hear me out. Hear me out. Okay.

    I always say I'm gonna do it, and then I don't. But I listen to podcasts. Yeah. I will be audibling all the books that I want to read in the year of an audible place. My, a d my ADHD Yeah.

    Can't handle just one. So I've got, like, 3 You're bouncing? I'm I bounce a lot. Yeah. But I bounce a lot when I read.

    Oh, see. I don't. I'm committed to 1. I know. That's your problem.

    That's your problem. That's why. But no. That's probably why you're having a hard time reading is that you're not just, like, you know what? I'm not in the mood for whatever, like, spooky book club we have.

    Yeah. I wanna read a little bit of this and then a little bit of that. And then you just, like, and then when the book dab it. And then when the book is, like, you're no longer entertaining me, I'm, like, and I fall off. I give up on books all the time.

    Not me. Why? Well, I'm also, like It's not worth your time if you're not into it. Just like I know life is too short to read a shitty book. Yeah.

    I've said that out loud before, and I was like, god. That's a this should go in a shirt. So there's this oh, god. She used to be called, like there's this, book like, bookstagram lady I follow, and she I think it's Coffee and Quintus? I don't I can't remember.

    But she always has so many books. It looks like she's reading so much. And, like, once a month, she'll be like, these are the ones I didn't finish. I started, got, like, 8 page in, and I was like, fuck this. Book.

    Yeah. Because life's too short. Life's too short. Life's too short. Should should you read a shitty book?

    I do think I'm just gonna audible things because I am gonna be driving a lot for the month of January. So Oh. Yeah. Isn't that weird? I'm gonna be driving a lot.

    You guys. Well, Jess hates driving. I hate driving, but a part of my job is to drive. I have to I'm an it's perfect. I'm an auditor, ironic, for a company, and I have to go meet clients.

    Casey Wilson and, who's the other person on her podcast? Danielle Schneider. Yeah. They have a book out. They have an audible book out that they both do.

    It's called The Art of Small Talk. That's what you should do. The Art of Small Small Talk sometimes makes me cringe. It makes me cringe too, so I didn't listen. I, like, I will go back.

    I'm I'm toggling between that and Andy Poehler's yes. Please. Okay. I never read that. So the last book that I read that Casey Rose Wilson oh, her biography.

    I love it so much. I love it so much. Essays or whatever the many, many essays of what is it called? I forget. I can't remember.

    Oh, put some respect on its title. I don't remember. Wait. Did you let me borrow it? I did.

    I did. It was so good. Oh my god. It was so ridiculous. I love to hear them.

    It made me audibly laugh many a time. Yeah. It made me rewatch, Happy Endings. Oh, I know. I needed to get have you never watched it?

    No. I started it. Probably one episode. Oh my god. Everybody, Darion's here.

    She's hanging out with us because we were like, we all we need to record and then we're like, come in here. Come in here. Because this is the protected space. It is a protected space. There's no babies.

    No baby? No kids allowed. No. I used to be kids. I There used to be kids allowed.

    I don't know. My dog dare a dad to open that fucking door, and they will all just die. They know better. Yeah. And I and I would just give them the fucking eyes.

    They would be like, don't do it. Literally, if Mondo were to have the urge, Tommy and Aldridge would be like, don't. Oh, what was I saying? But okay. Oh, yeah.

    Christmas break. Christmas break. Kids are home. Shit's rough. Shit's fucking rough.

    But we've done some cool shit. I mean, okay. So kids were home. But yeah. So Yeah.

    Everybody so long story long, many families in different areas. So we had many Christmases before the actual Christmas. I'm already tired. I've already had to make eye contact. Oh my god.

    Did I I told you this that night because I had to come home I had to come to your house drunk that night after the Christmas at my mom's house. Were you were you just yawning on the inside? No. It's burping. Oh, okay.

    So I show up to my mom's house, and there's a plaque of Trump. It's not a picture. It's a plaque. A plaque. A plaque and with etched shit.

    I literally wanted to rip it off the wall and fucking punt it into the next room. It's just anywhere. But I go I immediately go, what the fuck is this? And my mom's husband goes, we don't talk politics on Christmas. You cannot not talk politics when you have a huge truck.

    So I literally look at my mom, and she can see it. And she's like, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck. And I finally, like, find a minute to calm down, and I go, mom, do me a favor. Next Christmas, don't put that up. If you want me to feel any bit of comfort in this home, don't put that up.

    If it's up on the regular, please take it down. Like Know your audience. Know your audience. Your family to come out here. Please understand, mom.

    I crop I could not stop sobbing the day that he was, the day that it happened. That day. That day. I couldn't stop sobbing. I called into work.

    I'm affected, like, do not. And so, yeah, many Christmases, lots of family exhausted. And then we go on a staycation. That was fun. It sounded fun.

    It was a lot of fun. I think that we should do that together. I honestly think that uh-oh. Do we need help? We're good.

    I honestly think it's not a smooth, door open. Sorry. Sorry in advance. That I kind of, like You're thinking, oh, I'm gonna break it. Thing.

    Nothing will break it, but it doesn't also close all the way, so you're good. Oh. Oh, she's yeah. Yeah. You did it.

    Yeah. Which is better than I normally do. Oh, so but, yeah, so we did a staycation. We went to PB. I love it.

    It was so much fun. We did Thursday, Friday, Saturday night, went home Sunday. Thursday night, Aldridge and I shut the bar down across the street. So we stayed at the Ocean Pacific Inn at the end of Grand. So on the beach, it was Yeah.

    Super fun. Right across the way from us is the Shore Club that Aldridge and I used to go to when we were, like, young and hip and shit. And Mondo's been there. And so and so we, like we're, like, okay. Well, the kids are, like, they're not down, but they're in the hotel room They're fine.

    3rd floor. Not fucking like, who care? They're happy. They're on their tablets. They're 10 and 7.

    Don't judge me. So we ditched the kids, and we go across the street. We shut the fucking bar down. I don't remember stumbling back home even. I know.

    It was so fun. And then the next morning, we wake up. We stumble over to have mediocre breakfast that like, I don't know why. This place has, like, all the, like, 5 star reviews. What place is that?

    I don't wanna say it because I don't wanna poop on it. I'll cut it out. It's like Kono something? Kono breakfast? Kono something.

    Tim Kono? I know. I wonder if it's because the Hawaiian of it all. I don't wanna poo poo on them. Oh, it's a it's a Hawaiian spot?

    It's claiming to be a Hawaiian spot, but it but help me understand. If you're a breakfast Hawaiian spot, your eggs and things or your zippies or your nuts I don't okay. Literally, I didn't see spam, Portuguese sausage. No. You're not a Hawaiian spot.

    That's what I'm saying. Well, fuck yourself. And I, I went and I said, hey. I've never been here before. What am I gonna order?

    And he was like, oh, if you've never been here before, you need to order this. And I said, yes. Because I had my eye on it anyway. We both, like, exchanged, like, niceties. It was like a a it was like a scramble that had, like, bacon, green bell pepper, onion, eggs, and then a side of, like, hash brown.

    That sounds like you could get that at IHOP, though. Because you can. And it would probably have salt and pepper in that bitch. What? It was so unseasoned.

    It was so cringe. I literally look over at Aldridge, and I'm like, I know I'm hungover, so I don't typically have an appetite when I am hungover. But this shit is not good. Like, I gave it a Unseasoned? It was, honestly, I my problem is Is there white wait.

    Wait. Was that, like, white guy who took my order? Like, aloha themed breakfast. It was legit Hawaiian guy. I think he was Hawaiian who took my order.

    But he's a server. He was he he took He looks like the owner. No. You walk up to the thing, and then you find a seat. You're on your own.

    That sounds like white person goes to the side of the line. It was it was the weird highest Polynesian. It was the weirdest shit. And I look and and I'm thinking, maybe it's me. No.

    It's Aldrich too because he ordered a burrito that, like, was supposed to be all the rage. It was essentially my scramble wrapped up in a tortilla, so he also got bland food just in a prettier package. I don't know. It was very underwhelming. And then I don't like breakfast foods when we go out.

    So if there's an underwhelming breakfast food, it makes me lucid. Okay. So I don't know why am I sitting here? Here. I was literally like, why am I sitting here?

    I could be out, like, looking at the beach, like, looking at the water. Like, it's on the water, like, the port walk. You could have gone to any talk Anywhere else. Anywhere else. And I was like, well, maybe they have, like, all like, maybe it's, like, all the rage for people who are, like, transplants and who've never tasted seasonality.

    Like, tourists? I don't it was embarrassing that we were there. I will say that. I was like, is this really, like, San Diego food? Like, no.

    I feel better. Thank you. Thank you everybody for listening. Thank you, for thank you for listening to this TED Talk. Thank you for this, I feel better.

    But no. So okay. And then so we go I don't know how so okay. So fry or Thursday night, Aldrich and I closed the bar down. Friday, we go back and we're like, let's do it again.

    And we get there, and there's so many young 20 somethings Oh. Around us, and Aldrich and I are like, what's happening? Also, we're, like, old, so we're still licking the wounds from the night before and also trying to day drink, and that's not going well. Like, it was just so it was just a very it was a very humbling experience. And oh my god.

    And then so we're on the rooftop of this. I think it was called the firehouse or the ale house or whatever. It's, again, across the street from our hotel. It was just, like, one place over. And I'm looking at Aldridge, and, like, 2 inches to the left his left, my right, Taco Bell was just staring at me.

    I was like, oh, shit. We might be going to Taco Bell tonight. And I look at him, and I can see he's suffering. Like, he's try like, we're trying to be like, yeah. We're cool.

    We're cool. All these people young around us looking fresh, and, you know, we look the way we feel. And then I'm looking at him, and I'm like, love, there's Taco Bell. And we don't eat Taco Bell often, because it's garbage. Right?

    But we're like, love, it's Taco Bell. He was like, I mean, we can't walk over there. I said, I have had one and a half drinks. I will go pull our car out of the garage, and we will drive through that Taco Bell. Did we?

    Yes. And did you go back to the bar? No. Mom, we got the Taco Bell back to the room. It was so good.

    That does sound more fun. It was so nice. And then I have bar. Immediate jammies Yeah. And just horizontal Yeah.

    And buzzed with Taco Bell. It was so nice. I don't know. That sounds glorious. And then and then so we did that for a few days, and then we got back home.

    And then I was like, oh, cool. The kids get to go back to school. No. I can't believe they're not back in school yet. My kids are still at home.

    They don't go back to school until 2 days from now. What dish? I'm still suffering. San Marcos. The kitchen side's the same way.

    Yeah. Wait. They're not back in school yet either? Yeah. They go back to 13th.

    I don't know what it is. So this is, like, literally when this airs. I'm like, we don't even have ski week. We're we live in San Diego. Extend the summer by a week, but take this fucking winter break shit and When did it do less.

    Too early. Too early. Too early. Yeah. They've been out for 3 weeks.

    Yeah. My kids only did 2 weeks. They're back they went back this week. Mhmm. It was rough.

    Why you look all well rested and shit? I'm like, oh my god. I'm definitely not well rested. Still holding a hostage. Okay.

    Let's do it. Okay. My update is I have nothing. It was just a long slog of holidays and playdates and Lexapro. Lexapro.

    I did go I did go to Disneyland. Oh, yesterday at Disneyland? Yeah. See, look at you. I'm walking around.

    I'm in Batuu, star wars land. Oh. And guess who walks past me? Wait. Are you gonna say somebody famous?

    Yeah. Just put the fuck up. I love this game. Oh, wait. I I know the answer to the Wait.

    How do you know? Did you talk to her? No. No. You They talked about it at at Oh, they did.

    Is it somebody I would know? Yeah. Is it La la Kent? No. It's Gordon Ramsay.

    Tommy walks Do you know Aldridge would have literally fucking died? Tommy loves him so much, walks right past him. And then I see him. He's walking this he didn't even notice him. He's walking this way, and I'm like, Sammy, and he thought I lost Jack.

    So he goes, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho So good. But I Wait a minute. Yeah. Do you know Aldridge would have shit his pants? We watch Gordon Ramsay often.

    Yeah. Tommy only like like, Gordon Ramsay and, like, Paul Hollywood are his, like, top 2 like, that's the only people he trusts their opinion Yeah. For cooking. Everybody else can suck it. Yeah.

    Everyone else can suck it. He doesn't trust anyone else but those 2. Wait. Who's the other guy? Paul Hollywood?

    Hollywood from the Great British Bake Off? That's where he gets all of his baking recipes. That's why he Yes. I bought this book. Did Baker.

    Okay. Well, we're back, everybody. Wait. Oh. I'm gonna pre pop that.

    Yeah. We're back. I hope everyone enjoyed those episodes. I love Belle Gibson. You know what I noticed about the Belle Gibson episode?

    It's the first time we said Dickensian. Oh my god. I literally enjoyed okay. So this is gonna sound crazy. So because we didn't record Uh-huh.

    I missed us. So I was listening to our episodes, and they they were giving me life all over again. And when we said to Kenzie, and I was like, I'm gonna be the 1st time I looked to Kenzie. I was like, oh. And we were like, oh, all of our 12 listeners, and, oh, god.

    It was just so much fun. It was a good time. I know. It was fun making that one. It was in the garage too.

    We, like, had a brief moment where we were in the garage, and we were like, this is the new place to record. We're gonna get it. Oh. And then, Tommy took it over and meet at his office. And then we saw this.

    And and I get a really long period in between. Yeah. We were floating around. We were homeless podcasters for a minute. Yeah.

    We were transient podcasters. Transient. Transient podcast. Train how train how a podcast is. Train how.

    So okay. Let's get into it. This one, there's a trigger warning for animal abuse, suicide, and sexual assault. Animal abuse. Wild and crazy.

    Yeah. Okay. Let's 2025 it real quick. Yeah. I know.

    So welcome back. Welcome back. We're starting off real great. And, actually, this isn't like I feel like the last handful have been kind of, like, more UFO y things, and I did intend for this not to be kind of a UFO situation. It does go there, though, because I think that's just what people fucking do now.

    Is that what it is? I think it's not try to avoid and all roads lead back to UFO. I literally every week, I'm like, I'm not gonna do a UFO one, and it somehow always comes back to fucking UFO. As I'm staring at your fucking UFO that's, like, literally right behind you have a UFO. Like, I do.

    Do you have a UFO? You are literally, like, subconsciously channeling all things UFO. Possibly. Also, Tommy got me this really cute painting or not painting. It's like a little, like, tapestry thing Oh, good.

    On a UFO. Wait. Where did he get that? Etsy. Wait.

    With the frame and everything? Yeah. That looks so fucking cool. Isn't it cute? Yeah.

    It is so cute. UFOs. Go, Tommy. Go yeah. Okay.

    Well, now I'm at the crib. I'm not trying. I'm not trying to find these UFO things, but maybe it's my algorithm. Maybe it's your algorithm, but maybe it's just, like, everything's happening. It's the universe telling you.

    Yeah. Okay. So Bentinho Massaro was born March 13, 1988 in Amsterdam in the Netherlands. His mother was a school teacher. His father worked for an energy company, and they lived a pretty average middle class life.

    I also wanna preface this by saying, this guy sucks. I'm already feeling like Switzerland can take him right back. In the Netherlands. Did I say Switzerland? Yeah.

    Did you? No. I said the Netherlands. Why am I why am I like this? Oh my god.

    You just felt like I mean, you wouldn't be wrong if you saw him. He's just very, like, Nordic looking, like, blonde hair, blue eyes, but, no, he does suck, and there's, like, conflicting information out there, but he he does suck. Also, remember earlier when we were talking about how kids nowadays are saying the r word? He regularly uses the r word. Who does that?

    And he's 2 years younger than us. When I say us, I meant me. By us, I meant me. Yeah. So What does that?

    This guy. So this is the first trigger warning for animal abuse. So he says he when he was young, he got a kitten who was a little skittish, so he put the cat on a leash, and he would take it around the house to, like, bond with it, And then one day, he felt an evil spirit take over his body, and then he swung the kitten by the leash into a prickly bush, not once, just, like, over and over and over again. Like helicoptering this fucking cat into a fucking, like, cactus? I don't know if it was a cactus.

    It was a prickly bush. Immediately, I went cactus. I mean, I don't, I think to the kitten, there was no difference. I don't know. Did it live?

    I there don't know. TV. But so Fuck. He's him told this story. I knew that immediately you were gonna be like How is that your reaction?

    My reaction? No. The guys. Like, they're feeling something, and I'm gonna go helicopter on this cat. So I also had that same thought.

    So if you watch, like, any, like, criminal, like, procedural show Yeah. Animal abuse in a in childhood is they say is, like, a big indicator of serial killers. So I did look into that because I was like, isn't the telomeres giving me a fucking I'm not gonna lie. There was a time where Shepherd was, like, bending really coolies backwards, like, not rolling them, but, like, over, like, rolling them the wrong way. And you were like, oh, no.

    I looked at Jenna. I was like, am I gonna have to get him evaluated? Like, what the fuck is happening to Shep? Why is he why is he overextending all of these poor rolling pulleys? I think it was the science of it all.

    I don't know. He's a big done it. Probably the science of it all. Yeah. He has a ton it.

    But, also It was a very bad situation. That's sad. Guys. That the the idea that it's it's not quite true. So I went on this nerdy tangent just because I thought it was important to know.

    So there's this thing called the McDonald Triad that originated in 1963 by psychiatrist John McDonald. Surprise there. And he theorized that certain behaviors, mainly cruelty to animals, fire starting, and persistent bed wetting past the age of 5, could predict could predict whether a child would grow up to commit violent crimes, including serial murder and adulthood. And this was kind of like the profiling standard for a very, very long time. Like, that's what we've always heard.

    However The bedwetting thing? The bedwetting thing too. And so there was this kind of subset group that was, like, there's a lot of problems with his research, mostly the fact that he only surveyed a 100 criminals that threatened to kill someone, but didn't actually commit murder. And then in a 2018 review so this is like in like we're really recent I mean really recent yeah a review of the study failed to find a history of all three behaviors among violent offenders so only 25% of aggressive inmates had committed animal abuse 45% of school shooters, and 21% of serial murders. So not all kids who abuse animals grew up to be serial killers, but it does point to some troubling tendencies, such as a conduct disorder, which is, like, you're not acting right, basically, which would lay which would include lack of empathy, remorse, guilt, and pathological lying, which I think illustrates preemptively where we're going with this.

    Right. So either so he's told this story a bunch of times. So either he's lying about the cat or he's because then he goes back later, and he's, like, no. That never happened. So either he's lying about the cat or he's lying about the cat not happening.

    Right. There's I think he's a pathological liar. That is me, allegedly. Allegedly. Allegedly.

    That might be me too. Yeah. TBD. So he also told his girl one of his girlfriends later on that he was diagnosed early with a narcissistic personality disorder and used to peep poop on people's lawns. Stop it.

    Hold on. I know. I need to tell you a story. No. Wait.

    Listen to this. Oh, god. I get sore. He denies ever being diagnosed with a narcissistic personality do disorder, but he was like, yeah. I did shit on people's Yeah.

    I did shit on people's lawns, though. Hold on. But when Massaro was 10, his parents got really into the self help movement, specifically a system called the Silva method, in which one sustains a brain frequency of 7 to 14 hertz, and that will allow one to gain psychic abilities. That's a super, oversimplification because I really don't understand what that is. Yeah.

    No. And, Taynday, hurt what is hurt? Like, what is that a measure up? Measurement? Sound or energy, I think.

    I went straight to, like, electric Brainwaves? Yo. Yeah. Maybe it is electric because I think, I think it is. I don't know, to be honest.

    His parents enroll Bentinho in a youth program, And he wasn't, like, too pissed about it because he loved learning all he could about spirituality. He goes to India as a teen and studies yoga, meditation, and returns to the Netherlands with the spiritual confidence of a middle class white dude. Okay. You had me until you said middle class white dude because everything else sounded, like, super fucking rad. Yeah.

    But, you know, there's, like I I'm gonna, like, also say that, like, if you ever, like, see pictures of him, there's, like he's, like, very blonde, very blue eyed, very, like, white guy, but he's always, like, doing prayer hands looking into the camera. Can you? Yeah. Performative. I don't know.

    I I actually don't know if it's super performative. I believe that he believes all the stuff about himself. Perhaps. But I I I hate him. Yes.

    So Massaro starts his YouTube channel in 2010, so he's 22 at the time. His first video is titled understanding life is impossible. And I tried to watch it, and I, like, literally could not I couldn't. So I I did watch another one that was a little bit later called what is bliss, And it was it was this is why I couldn't watch the other one. It's because it's him, like, holding a camera, like, walking and, like, smiling into the camera.

    Fringe immediately. Breathing hard because he's on a walk. I don't like to hear people breathe either. No. And smiling and, like, making eye contact into the camera.

    Honestly, there's It's, like, 5 minutes of that. I can't. There are TikToks when I feel like a guy is trying to, like like, be cute. I I immediately go to the next one. Yeah.

    I cannot be wooed. It was fucking weird. Yeah. But people were like, oh my god. You're so great.

    You're the best. You're you're you're the greatest healer of this generation. I don't know if I can get it. Mhmm. Because he's just talking in circles too.

    No. It's called what do they call it? Word salad? Word soup? Word salad?

    Mhmm. When you, like, talk in a circle? Anyway, so he's looking in the camera, long time jerk. Smiling. Yeah.

    That's kind of what it is. It's a circle jerk. It's a circle jerk of words. It is a circle jerk of words. So he's, like, looking in the camera for a long time, smiling, and then gives, like, some gen generic affirmations, and then follows up with, like, his, word spiritual word circle jerk situation, that doesn't make much sense.

    Like, one thing he says is, what is it that is seeing right now? Is it you? Is it is it the you that you believe to be? Is it seeing right now as an act, as a doing? Is art art?

    That's what it sounds like literally, like, he's trying to make things like Yeah. If you're vague Yeah. If you're vague and you sound philosophical enough Woah. Then like people will make their own conclusions. Yeah.

    And I'll be like, wow, you really made me think. Yeah. Because you provided 0 0. Yeah. 0 substance.

    Yeah. You you just took me on a fucking thinking journey I didn't wanna go on. I think that people think, like, oh, I don't get this. I need to break it down in my own mind to get it. But if you're a good teacher, no one has to fucking break it down and try to understand what you're saying.

    If you're a good teacher, people are, like, understanding and following along with what you're saying. Yeah. And it makes sense, and you're not being a weird creep. Yeah. So his videos start gaining traction, and he's invited to speak on spiritual in spirituality seminars and in panels.

    And now he's got, like, a pretty big following, and he's still very young. He's still, like, 22, 23. And he's got a lot of followers across Facebook, Instagram, YouTube. He ditches his, like because at first, he's got this, like, Euro backpacker vibe, like, you know, like Patagonia and, like, a backpack. Mhmm.

    Yeah. You know, that's all I have. But so then he starts I'm, like, a patch. There's a patch somewhere. Yeah.

    There's, like, some sort of patch or, like, you know There's, like He's wearing those shorts that are a little bit longer than normal Yeah. And maybe some, like, TiVo. He's got he's got a he's got a water bottle Oh, yeah. That has stickers of all of his things. Yeah.

    And it's, like, really big and, like, really battered, and he wears it like An accessory. Honor. Yeah. For sure. So he ditches that.

    Oh. And he starts work he starts GTLing himself. Oh, okay. So he starts working out. That's a hit.

    He gets a tip on. And he starts, like, projecting this, like, party vibe, like, out, like, smoking cigars and, like, drinking and, like, chicks all over the place. But some of his claims so he's still posting these, like, inspirational things where he's still, like, looking into the camera for a really long time being, like, you're beautiful, all these eye contact. Yeah. So some of his claims at this time was that he was a higher vibrational being than the rest of the people on earth.

    Okay. He is more enlightened than Jesus. Oh. So we've gone We've gone far. We've gone from people being like, I am Jesus reincarnated to To I am I am better.

    I am better. I am better than Jesus. I've got one better for you. I am in fact better than Jesus, motherfucker. So in his Instagram story too and a like that I I'm literally You're not even that old.

    Religious, but it's just the audacity of somebody to be is it audacity or audacity? Audacity. Did you say audacity? No. No.

    AU Audacity. Stop. I've never written it before. Yep. It is the audacity.

    It is the audacity. He has the audacity. The audacity. To say that he's better than I mean, obviously, I am the most non Jesus person. That's what I'm saying, but it's just But even I am like for somebody to be like, I am better than this being who get old.

    What do you think you are? No. So in an Instagram stories, like q and a, he describes himself as, quote, organically human, energetically what one would call an alien, comma, essentially God, all in caps. So he's saying Essentially. He's essentially God, but also energetically an alien.

    Yeah. And because he's an upper density being, that's quote, he could upper density being? Upper density being. I don't know what that means. I've literally never heard anybody use that.

    I'm immediately confused. I think that's on purpose. Exactly. He's just trying to sound how long do you think it took him to think of that? Probably, like, no seconds because he probably was, like, you know what I think?

    I think his parents were, like, you know what? You're so great. You're so You know what? You are better than Jesus. You are an upper density.

    You are an upper you give me upper density in such a way, I find This is why you need to humble your kids. Yeah. Anyway, so he because he's an upper density being, quote, him not not me saying that Mhmm. He could usher humanity to a higher plane of enlightenment by 2,035. He also claims to be able to control the weather and that he has telekinesis.

    And I did see a video. So Vice did, like, an interview with him, and it starts raining. And the lady is, like, the lady is, like, oh, it's raining. I didn't expect it. And he's, like, you can control that, you know?

    And she was, like, oh, I can. And he's, like, yeah. You just intend it intend it not to be. And she's, like, so I just close my eyes and intend it not to be, and it'll stop. And he was, like, yeah.

    And then Fuck right off. It does it keeps raining for, like, a really long time. I mean, because literally, nobody can Also the weather. The first ad for this fucking thing was that silver method thing that he was trained on. Oh, god.

    Targeted targeted ads. Oh, yeah. So his teachings were, like, a mishmash of the law of 1, which says that all things in the universe are the same. And if you think there's a difference, it's because you just don't know any better. And that's obviously a gross oversimplification.

    Has he telekinetically done anything to prove his telekinetic on, like, Instagram, he's like, look at me. There's, like, a strip of foil, and he goes like this, and it spins. But to me, it looks like he's blowing on it. From off camera? I'm like, does he think he's fucking Matilda?

    But that was proof. Yeah. That was yeah. Who do you think he was? You fucking fucking Matilda?

    Okay. I'm gonna fucking trunch pull your ass right now. Do you remember that time? Do you remember that time when we were like, let's bring that trunch pole fashion? Yes.

    Anyway, no. He, like, he posted this video of him moving this piece of tinfoil, which is notoriously so light Literally. So slow. Literally. He was like, this is proof of my telekinesis, but that it's, like, super zoomed in.

    Yeah. Like, literal okay. Stupid. Yeah. I think that he would have had better success, like, learning, like, sleight of hand magic and being like, oh, I can do telekinesis.

    Perhaps, like, a point behind Yeah. That, I think, would have been more impressive to me than the fucking piece of tinfoil. Yeah. So, anyway Okay. He also is a follower of the secret, which we is it that's Jay z Knight, isn't it?

    No. It's, what's the other episode we did? Fuck. I don't remember. Okay.

    Oh, James Arthur Ray. Jam James Arthur Ray. He was in The Secret, the documentary The Secret. Yes. Okay.

    So he he's also a follower of that school of thought, like manifestation, law of attraction stuff. So in 2013, he moves to Boulder, Colorado Colorado. Which is a hub for kind of, like, both a spiritual movement and tech. And in 2014, launches Bentinho Massaro TV, a site where you could access his videos for a fee, and he also starts a company called Trinfinity with the aim to help humanity reach that enlightenment that he keeps talking about. Mhmm.

    But the way that he conducted his business didn't really sit well with other members of Trinfinity, because it seemed like they were he was just, like, promoting himself. Right. So there was discussions of ousting him, and he caught wind. So he's like, fuck you. So he moves to Sedona, Arizona.

    Oh. Which is which is literally where all shit goes Yeah. Is in fucking Sedona. Is it the mountains of Sedona, do you think, that, like or the red rocks Is it the the the red rock Rushmore of Nicolas Cage's that draws them in? I think that's literally what it is.

    I think it is. Okay. Well, I know. I think it is. I think everyone is like, I don't know about Sedona, and then they glimpse that hairline in this But they're like, wait a minute.

    Mountain that mountain of multiple Nicolai. Hairline. Nicolai. Nicolai hairlines. And they're like, you know what?

    The mountains are calling. They're calling me. They're calling me. They're whispering. No.

    Wait. They whisper. So Why do I see Nicolas Cage doing the opposite of this? He's, like, yelling for the I only see for some reason, I think that, like, I think I showed you. Air.

    Wait. So I think I found a, like, someone had made a rendering of a Nicolas Cage Rushmore. Rushmore? And he's yelling in almost all of That that's what I'm saying. Yeah.

    I only see him yelling. Didn't they show you that? No. Oh, god. What?

    I need it so badly. It was just like He's like screaming in all of his interviews. One way to envision Nicolas Cage. And it's screaming. It's screaming.

    It's not a whisper. The the the mountains are calling loudly. The mountains are screaming. They're screaming Nicolas Cage style. Yes.

    Come here. Are calling. The Nikolai are calling. So in Sedona, he holds weekly talks at an art center, and he's still running retreats and events while maintaining this super strong social media presence. And the the barrier to entry is like really low right it's a follow and then if you're like I don't like it then you unfollow whatever sure but if you get hooked in you're starting to, like, find what he's saying, like, agreeable because it's big enough and, like, open ended enough that you kinda project your own shim.

    You can make anything, like, honest that's how I feel about uh-oh. I'm gonna you might have to edit this out. That's how I feel about, like, homilies at mass. They speak Wait. Who?

    Vaguely enough, like, when you go to church. Oh. I know. I know. I know.

    My audience. Know my audience. Audience. And I'm just saying even know that you were talking well. So many people can, like, hear something and essentially apply it to what they're experiencing in that moment and make it make sense and think, like, oh, all of this is, like like, incredible and, you know, whatever because you speak vaguely enough about something, and everybody can makes fill out the rest of the blanks, essentially.

    Yeah. So he does that, but, like, with, like, weird new age spiritual shit, and, again, still camera, eye contact, nonstop. Cringe. So a lot of what they would do at these like, in Sedona, these things, they were called distortion readings. Mhmm.

    And fellow followers would point out flaws and insecurities of, like, one person. And then the logic was was that sometimes we can't see our own hang ups, and we can lead we can, like, lean on the community to help reflect on our own distortions of reality. Okay. But none of these people are fucking licensed to do this What's happening? Which is, like, super fucking dangerous.

    And it, like, tips into just, like, psychological abuse territory because there's just a ton of people that are, like, you are not doing this. You're not doing that. And, like, instead of building resilience, what it does is it makes them not trust their own instinct. Yes. They're, like, you're right.

    I I don't because the shit that they're talking about, they're, like, you're not in your own divinity, And so because of that, you can't, like, I don't know, eat your eat shit right. I don't know. Who know whatever. Whatever. And so it makes them more vulnerable to suggestion by not not only by the group, but Massaro who then positioned himself as the highest authority to be the one that's better than Jesus somehow.

    So he's so he's like, you should cut like, anybody who doesn't follow the or, like, believe in this, you should just cut ties. Okay. Colt. Colt, Rod Fied. Rod Fied.

    Rod Fied. Right? Oh, this is the quote from him in the video. He says, quote, fuck your relationships, all of them, to your parents, to your family, to your friends, to the people around you. To me, fuck your relationships.

    They mean nothing. They mean nothing. Don't give a fuck about your family. Don't give a fuck about your children. Ew.

    Don't give a fuck about your parents. Don't give a fuck about your partner. That was all in 2017. That's not a red flag just smacking you in the face with the whips of Nguyen. How clever he was to be, like, don't give a fuck about me because he's, like, also including him in that.

    So people are, like, oh, no. He's not trying to take control because he's also He's including himself in the don't take advantage. But again, he's, like, I'm better than Jesus. Yeah. So, of course, they're gonna defer to anything he fucking says if they already believe it.

    It's just wild to me that somebody can say all of these things and, oh, god. I feel like every episode, I'm like, I don't get how people can You have a see you have a cognitive dissonance believing that people are like them? Cognitive dissonance of it all. A cognitive dissonance? One of our episodes, like, right before the break Right before break.

    Yeah. We had we cognitive dissonance, like It's where it was formed. Everything. Yeah. Yeah.

    It was great. So according to the law of 1, your perceived discord with the world around you, with the attachments, the responsibility, and obligations you might feel to people, the trauma you have experienced, they're not real. And if you're thinking like, if you think it's real, that's what's getting in the way of enlightenment. Oh, god. So, again, nothing is real.

    And, of course, there is one movie that almost every single cult leader has fucking referenced. What do you think it is? Oh, god. I can't remember. Are these We've talked about it at least 5 times.

    Oh, really? Yes. Oh, no. I'm on the spot. I don't know.

    Do you know? Mm-mm. Cult leaders will typically refer Modern cult leader. Modern cult leaders. It was one of the biggest movies of the nineties with Keanu Reeves.

    Speed? 1. Speed? 2? The Matrix.

    The Matrix? Honestly? Okay. Wait. To be honest?

    Speed is my number one, though. What the fuck is that speed? It is so Oh my god. That that that's Sandra Bullock. That's Sandra Bullock of it all.

    And good. Oh my gosh. She has my whole heart. She does have my whole heart. It's so good.

    We watched it in Japan twice because that was all that was on. Oh, you want it? Oh, it was. I was like, oh, that's insane. So you're watching speed, and every time the kids would be like, can we leave?

    And we're like, no. No. We cannot. I can't leave. This is when it gets good.

    Okay. Because literally that's it. Or like Bill and Ted's. No. I was not thinking matrix.

    Yeah. No. So the matrix. Okay. So I feel like this is probably, like, guru 5 to talk about the fucking Matrix.

    So if you haven't seen the film sorry, Bert. Mhmm. So, or know anything about it, which I maybe younger kids don't. You've never seen that? I've never watched the matrix.

    I've seen things. I've seen people dodge bullets. I know that there's a green pill and red pill. See? I know that there's a lot of sunglasses and trench coats.

    There is enough that you know Yes. That has, like, seeped into public discourse, into The cultural zeitgeist. Zeitgeist. So if you haven't seen it, it's about Mio with played by Keanu Reeves. And he believes he's living, like, a normal ass life, but then he comes to discover that nothing is real.

    And he's got, like, a human body, which is in, like, this weird incubator thing that's plugged in to this fake reality. So it's kind of like I don't know. It's like they're living like robloc it's like roblox is real. That is so precious. Know, but they don't know that they're living in Roblox, and then they get unplugged.

    And once he realizes that he's unplugged and nothing is real, he can go in and he can manipulate reality and dodge bullets and, like, no kung fu and all the just bullets. Because he's manipulating reality. So a lot of, like, these new age gurus, they use that as an example being, like, nothing is real. And once you realize nothing is real, you can also dodge bullets. So almost every guru is, like, I am me.

    I am which is obviously an anagram for 1 Yeah. Because there's all the things. So there so, anyways, he also applies this matrix terminology into his teachings. So nothing is real. Everything you know about the world is wrong, and Massaro is the only one that knows that's going on because he is the Neo slash better than Jesus.

    So you push down your instinct that tells you that this isn't right because you're like, maybe this is me thinking this is real and it's not real, so maybe this feeling isn't real. Right. You're just like, it's just a fuckery. It's a mind fuckery. Yeah.

    It's, yeah it's a mind fuckery yeah so you lean on him to fill in the gaps but what he's saying is also like just absolute garbage he says this is another quote from him the underlying subject of all objects is itself the subtle bit subtlest object of them all. This is a quote from Rolling Stone. He says in one recent post in which he gazes blankly into the distance. Oh. He's then goes on to say, release yourself of the subject as if it were a final object.

    You can deny focus and realize your true state is beyond. Does that make any sense to me? No. Yeah. But does it seem like it should make sense?

    It literally, like, he is like, he's saying something, and you're, like, man, I must be not with it. I don't get it. Hold on. I'm, like, I'm literally holding on to every word to try to make it make sense. It's not.

    That's the scam. Yeah. It's like, like, so wise. Me enough to make, like, oh, I'm so dumb. They're like, oh, no.

    No. Yeah. Sure. You must be, oh, you must be smart. Because you're using big words and and talking in circle you're talking circle jokes of words, and I yeah.

    No. I don't understand. It doesn't make sense. But if you're confused enough and somebody is looking at you and And you're desperate enough. He then you know what?

    It makes sense to him, so it might make sense to me. I'm just not getting it. I'm just I'm gonna go along with it. Mhmm. So he also would encourage his inner circle to do grape juice cleanses and weird fasts.

    One Grape juice. Grape juice. Okay. Honestly so alright. Wait.

    There's I'll get there. Yep. And it's fucked up my thoughts on this. So there's one weird fast that he did. It was a mix of grape juice, bentonite clay, and charcoal.

    And my beef bentonite clay, stop putting things in your mouth. It doesn't belong there. It's not it's you you know, you put it on your face. It's supposed to suck the toxins out. Oh, is that the the red yeah.

    Yeah. You're not supposed to It's literally called that. I'm not being rude. Yeah. It's called yeah.

    That's what it's called. So it's that. The charcoal, I get, because I also ingest charcoal. But then I was so hung up on the grape juice, because in my mind, I was like, that's a high tone? Well no.

    It was such a high sugar content. Yeah. Because I'm, like, trying to figure out what if if you're trying to do a a fast. I don't know. But that was my first I didn't I didn't even blink at the bentonite clay at first.

    I was like, great. Too great. That's literally where I was like, But then I thought, what if he's like, you know, wine is made because they don't wanna stop drinking. He's like, you know, wine is grape juice, and so maybe it allowed them to have wine. That's the only thing I could think of.

    Because otherwise, why grape juice? Not grapefruit juice like other cults. Could that be considered cognitive dissonance? Probably. No.

    I think that's right. I Yeah. There's there's element of cognitive dissonance. But let's not stop drinking. Yes.

    Yes. Because I think that that's also kind of where he gets, like he's got that party Yeah. Persona. So he claims that it was just a side thing between friends, but, again, his inner circle is still his students, and he's still saying that he is more enlightened than Jesus. Oh, Jesus.

    So there from that point, there is no, like, just friends. Mhmm. Right. Everything is gonna be a student teacher relation. Absolutely.

    You are not gonna be, like, oh, I'm better than Jesus, better than everything, but I'm also your equal. Yeah. No. If Jesus was, like, alive and was, like, you know what you should do? Yeah.

    This grape this grape juice cleanse. I think that Maybe eat this face mask. Yeah. Maybe eat this face mask. Yeah.

    Yeah. You're gonna be home for He he's Jesus. Yeah. Sure. He's not he's better.

    Yeah. Which is all of his audacity. His the audacity. The audacity. Oh my god.

    You saw an audacity. I literally, today, years old. I am so b Schofield is a journalist that we've talked about before on a cultured episode Uh-huh. A while ago. And she was already in Sedona when she caught wind of Bentinho, and, immediately, her bullshit radar went off.

    So she infiltrated the group. I know. This is b Scofield. I had to say on the fucking inside? Yes.

    B Scofield okay. B Scofield is such a fucking badass, and I think that, like, I might be your biggest fan. I mean because I talked I talked about her way too much. Bitch energy, though, to, like Bad bitch energy. In and be like, I wanna I I smell bullshit from this side of the mountains.

    Yeah. She's an alias. She goes in and infiltrates the group, and then on December 1, 2017 posts a Medium article titled Tech Bro Guru Inside the Sedona Cult of Bentinho Massaro, which if Tech Bro Guru isn't, like, the most perfect, like, descriptor Right. Tech Bro Guru. Tech pro guru.

    Uh-huh. No. Bro. Oh, Tech pro. Tech bro.

    Tech bro. Guru. Tech Tech bro. Guru. With his weird steely eyes and his weird prayer in his hands, looking at the camera.

    Fuck yourself. Yeah. So the article blows up, brings a lot of negative attention to Massaro and Trinfinity. Perfect. And their internal response was, these are evil forces out to get us because they don't wanna bring they don't wanna spring this great awakening to the planet.

    Their public response was, Bea Scofield isn't a cult. We're not in a cult. She's in a cult. The cults of the lame American media. Okay.

    Which based on that sentence, I can I feel like you know where this is going eventually? Mhmm. So they navigate the cult label for the next year. In 20 December of 2018, he hosts a 12 day retreat called the Sedona Experiment 2, and this is a trigger warning for suicide. Or no.

    I know. So during the retreat, a follower named Brent Wilkins was found at the bottom of a ravine having jumped from a bridge to end his life. Fuck. Brent was a former former tennis coach and spiritual seeker who had been a longtime follower of Massaro and was very involved in the Trinity community. He was struggling with his mental health in the year leading up to the retreat, and his death sent a shockwave through the community.

    Investigators are, like, we're pretty sure it's suicide. But after talking to Brent's mother, who was, like, he would've never done this. No. She was, like, he he's in a cult. Like, you need to look at this guy.

    Yes. He was cool, then he joined this cult, and now he's dead. So they do some digging and investigate a little further, and they find a video of Massaro saying, quote, you can't die unless you want to. Looking forward to death makes you truly come alive. Wake up to something important.

    Otherwise, kill yourself. Okay. So he was basically, like, kill yourself. Like, literally, like, you're miserable. You you're not these things, so you should just kill yourself.

    Yeah. Very much like Teal Swan. That is so fucking sad. And that's obviously very problematic, but also insidiously ignorant. Yeah.

    Like, and dangerous on their part to even put that out there because 1,000 percent. That, like, you know, people who deal with, like, depression, it's always very cyclical. Oh, yeah. Right? Right.

    And so Like, you're at the lowest point Yeah. And an authority that you think You think is better than Better than Jesus. It's like Okay. If you can't do this, kill yourself. Go ahead.

    Do us all a favor, basically. I I took that too far. I mean, that you're not far from was not yeah. It's probably not far from it's not far. I I think it's super fucked up.

    And I think that, like, my beef with, like, my beef with Bentinho Massaro and Teal Swan having this, like, rhetoric around suicide that they're not qualified, like, mental health providers. Who are they? Looking to they have a responsibility as teachers, and they're like, well, no. I freedom of speech. I can say whatever I want.

    But you have a responsibility as a teacher to not put shit out there that's gonna harm your students. Right. I fucking hate them. Anyway, so the lead investigator said Massaro was cooperative, and the death was ruled a suicide, but the whole thing left his followers confused by his lack of compassion or remorse for putting out the video that encouraged followers to kill themselves. Jesus Christ.

    His respond his public response was, quote, I love Brent. His suicide was highly unfortunate, painful, and a shocking surprise to all of us. Had I had I seen it coming somehow, so he's already distancing. Interesting. I would have done my best to intervene or get him professional help.

    You literally fucking told him to go ahead and do it. He I don't remember that. Again The intention behind that statement or similar statement was simply to encourage people to value lives, not devalue, exclamation point First of all. Which I don't know why that exclamation point makes me so fucking mad. And the precious opportunity we all have of being alive, my intention was to inspire people to prioritize their existences more consciously.

    So that's kind of like a bullshit not what It's a sorry, not sorry. Yeah. After the story blew up, Massaro cut and run. He was like, I'm out of here. He left Sedona and the following he had there and took a small amount of followers with him, and they traveled the world, like, living it up.

    Where are they now? Never mind. Tell me later. Story's not over. I know.

    Sorry. I just immediately I was like, where are they? I I immediately envisioned them like an Ibiza or something. Don't know. Fuck.

    It probably isn't Ibiza. Oh, wow. So they traveled the world posting party pics from the Caribbean, the pyramids, while a small group set up a new retreat center in a monastery in the Netherlands. And this is where he was going to set up a utopian community that he had been promising, that one that's gonna be, like, oh, by 2025 or 2035. That's this year.

    Okay. Everyone is gonna be enlightened. So, of course, most of the work was left to followers who weren't compensated, and Massaro was like, no. We just run this company like a family. Like, we all pitch in, but he, like, obviously benefits monetarily.

    And then he was also very open about participating in a polyamorous lifestyle and had a constant rotating cast of girlfriends. Wow. PS, nothing wrong. I was just gonna say, wait. Are are people allowed to?

    Because what I've noticed No. So nobody no cult leader wants anybody else. So this is the thing. Having the sexy times. Yeah.

    Just just that. Exactly. So he's like, yeah. Poly is being, like, so great. However, healthy polyamorous relationships are built on a foundation of consent and trust.

    Okay. One of his core teachings was that you should have sex with multiple partners, and that that could be a form of spiritual fulfillment even if you aren't comfortable with it. So because he's constantly telling people that nothing is real and they don't trust their instincts. And boundaries of a lot of women would participate, and they'd they'd convince themselves that these boundaries are wrong. But, also, once they were in this polyamorous relationship with him, he did not he was not cool with them being with other people.

    Exactly. But he could be with whoever. The audacity. The audacity. I can't.

    Okay. That's the last time I'm gonna say it. It's not the last time I'm gonna say it. No. So they were basically convinced their boundaries are wrong.

    So they're like, I guess I'm gonna do this. It doesn't feel right, but nothing I feel right is real or whatever. Anyway, so I guess I'm just gonna ignore all these feelings that I'm having. Yeah. So he writes in a group text quote, whenever I connect with a young woman, I don't need anybody's fucking doubts because they can't see beyond the image.

    People should look the other way when I fuck a woman to freedom. What? I knew you were gonna Oh my god. What? The fuck?

    The audacity t. The audacity. People should look the other way when I fuck a woman to freedom. She's not experienced never mind. That was I was like, no o's for her.

    No o's for her. I don't know why I took him there. It wouldn't be that way. Why am I this way? Why?

    So this leads to environment where everyone is sleeping with each other, which is important for a leader seeking course of control because you want to control the full the followers' most intimate relationships because if they're out there forming relationships with other people There might be deeper connection, you lose And then they're like Wait. What? Yeah. That doesn't sound right. And then you lose your control.

    So during this time, he starts relationships with both a woman named Jade Electra, who's a yoga teacher from California, and Jackie Graham, who is a Canadian vegan restaurateur. They weren't at the same time, but there's kind of, like, this crossover. So I'm gonna kinda talk about them, one after the other. But there's many other girlfriends, but these are the 2 women that came forward, so I'm just gonna, like, focus on them. Okay.

    So Jackie, the Vigan the Vigan? The Vigan. The Vigan. Fresh on tour. She had so her journey starts off with him love bombing the shit out of her.

    Usually. And he tells her that he wants to marry her, have children with her. She already has, like, some kids. Right? So she's like, oh, this is kind of like filling my cup.

    She's like perfect, you know, because I mean, there's okay. Go ahead. Yeah. She's blood vomiting her. Yeah.

    But then also at the same time, telling her that she needs to lose weight. Fuck him. I know. I dare somebody. I know.

    So apparently, he did this with all of his girlfriends because one of his ex girlfriends said that he withheld sex until she lost weight because there are toxins stored stored in fat cells. And he says, I've never withheld sex. But, yeah, I did tell her she needed to lose that fat because of the toxin. Oh my god. He was like, I certainly fucked her to freedom, but, didn't But, like didn't wanna, you know Yeah.

    We were really thinking that the toxins of the fat cells were the issue here. Why'd you have to even clarify? Yeah. Like, my why like, the way that he clarifies makes me hate this. So much more.

    He's making it worse. He makes it worse. So she follows him to the Netherlands where they're having or where he said that he was having issues setting up a bank account, which no one has a fucking issue. Like, I'll do it. No.

    Okay. She doesn't offer, but then he says, let's just, like, not even date. Let's, like, skip ahead and get married. And she's like, what? And he's like, well, you know what, though, is, like, more powerful than, like, being legally married.

    It's just, like, joining our bank accounts. That's, like, more Mhmm. Special, more, like, the It's more binding. It's more meaningful. Us together in such a way.

    And she said that, like, her heart kinda sunk when this happened because she was like, oh, god. I mean, you should not ignore this red flag. But she's, like, I loved him so much. Is she allowed? And he was, like, love bombing her so hard that she was, like, I yeah.

    Sure. Sure. Anything. And he said he wanted to invest money so that he could give his teachings for free, and together, they'd share this residual income. So she was, like, so it's for the greater good.

    This is just what I used to do on the front end. Yeah. So then she's like okay. So she gives him 100 of 1,000 of dollars. Wait.

    Hold on. Where is she getting all this money? She's a restaurant. Oh, she's a restaurant. I forgot.

    Okay. And so after she gives him this money, his attitude changes. I bet it does. And he's like, this you know what? All of a sudden, I'm not that into you.

    And a few weeks later, he comes to her crying, saying he lost all the money in a bad crypto investment, and she forgives him and agrees to pay back 20% of the amount he owed her. And he says, again, his clarification, he says, no. She gave me the money as, like, as a gift or a donation. Oh, god. A donation?

    Yeah. He also says he didn't lose interest in her sexually after the donation, but after that, it was just renationally. Renational? Relational? Relational.

    And thus sexually well because of certain character patterns that started showing up in her behavior, which I will not disclose here because I love her and respect her privacy and dignity. So, basically, she sucks as a human, but I'd still fuck her, but I won't tell you why she sucks as a human to me. Because I'm above it. Because I'm just would never do something like because I'm better than Jesus. Yeah.

    I'm better than Jesus. So another thing happens is that once they're at dinner and Bentinho was like, yo, take your top off. And she's like, no. Fuck you. Absolutely not.

    Leading up to this, he's been, like, you're too masculine. You're too masculine. Because he was all about, like, women are, like, soft and all about softness and surrender, and he's, like, you're too masculine. So he's, like, you need to take your top off, and she's, like, no. And then he's, like, you're being masculine again.

    And she's, like, is that, like, me being masculine needing control? And so then he tells her body? Yes. So then he tells her this story about a couple who were at dinner. It's like this old proverb where the partner the man is, like, hey, break this teacup.

    And the woman's like, why would I do that? It would break a teacup. I'm not gonna do that. And he's like, well, if you love me, just do it. It's a sign of your love.

    And she does it, and then they're like, oh, run off into the sunset together. Oh, god. And so she, afterwards, is, like, fuck. I fucked up. Because everything with him is a teaching, so I fucked up.

    I should've taken my top off. That's so stressful. Which, obviously, there's a huge difference between breaking a teacup and taking off your cock. Yeah. And being exposing yourself when you're not feeling comfortable to do so.

    Yeah. So she starts to feel gross about the lost investment, so she confides in another member who then immediately runs and tells him. He then accuses her Judas. The audacity of that of that Jude. So then he accuses her of being an evil entity and, quote, a spy coming here to try and separate everyone and plant seeds of doubt in the community.

    Oh, god. He to stay, she would have to confess to everyone anything negative she has ever felt about them, which she does. Oh, no. And she still feels gross, but then in 2020, she comes across The Vow, which is a documentary series on Max about Nixxiom, which we did in episodes 20 or 32 and 33. Uh-huh.

    The Sarah burn it down, Sarah. Burn it down. Burn it down. And immediately, she's like, oh, fuck. What the fuckage?

    She's like, oh my god. I'm not a part of something special. I'm not a part I'm like, this isn't a special I'm literally oh my god. This is literally a narcissistic abuse cult. Oh my god.

    I've literally of all the episodes we've ever done, I don't think that we've ever had, like, a moment where somebody is be like, somebody's in it. Yeah. But then they see something from another episode. Uh-huh. Yeah.

    And they're like, oh, fuck. Yeah. This is cool. Just wait. Just wait.

    So jumping forward a little bit or, no, jumping back a little bit. Oh, okay. Jade Electra. She is like, has a really big following on Instagram for being a yoga teacher, and she was sent a video of Massaro in 2017 by a friend and colleague. And at first, she was like, this is lame, but she followed because she was, like back then, like, in 2017, it was a lot of, like, Instagram for yoga teachers was very much, like, like, 30 day yoga challenges.

    Very, like, posturally Yeah. Minded. And so if you saw someone that had, like, substance, and that might help you look like sequencing or inspire you, you would just follow them. Didn't matter, and then, eventually, you just unfollow them. Unfollow them if they don't speak to you.

    Yeah. But So she does that. And, she starts engaging more with Massaro online and with his girlfriend, Corrie. And in 2021, Corrie invites Jade to Ecuador. And at first, Jade was scared and apprehensive, but she had recently had a tarot reading that said that she was gonna be with a man who was good for the world, and they would do great things together.

    And Oh, no. She thought she, like, she thought this might be it. Right. She's like, maybe this is the natural way. Is about Of course.

    So she ignores the pit in her stomach and go flies out to meet Massaro. And then once once she's there, he love bombs the shit out of her, tells her that she has the code for enlightenment, and that she should come with them to Panama. So she does. She pays her own way for the flight and room aboard and all the stuff. And then, quickly, she realizes that to be Massaro's new girlfriend is, like, instant enlightenment to the followers.

    Everyone was, like, oh my god. You're so amazing. And so she was getting love bombed by not just him, but also his followers. It's like, oh, this must be it. Like, this is you know, feels good.

    Yeah. She's, like, flying high on Yes. Like, all of the attention, and they're the community was, like, he's so nourished when he's with you. Like, he's spiritually better when he's with you. Oh, that's true.

    Her Yeah. Like, it made her feel good. Yeah. Yeah. Because, yes, that would make you feel wonderful.

    Yeah. And so not like, he's this incredible thing to the community, and then when he's with me, he's that much better. Yeah. Like, I'm essentially giving, like, all of this good to the community. Yeah.

    And this is also a side note. It's also gross, but Massaro is, like, Jade was never my student and that she sought Yeah. Quote, she sought a sexual relationship. Oh, wait. Did I not put the whole thing?

    Okay. Oh, no. I did put the whole thing. So he says she sought the sexual relationship, and this is, like, the super gross deductive quote, but I think it illustrates what a piece of shit he is. He says, quote, she was very sexually active, initiatory, and interested more so than myself, which is common.

    Okay. Yeah. Get the fuck out of here. And, also, though, not to objectify Jade, but, like, she was, like, a radiant goddess with, like, legs for days. Okay.

    And maybe she just had a baby healthy than him. Yeah. And maybe That doesn't make sense to me. No. Well, and maybe she just had a really incredible sex drive in general.

    Yeah. Also, don't sex shame people that are willing to have sex with you. You fucking piece of shit. Are you biting the hens that's literally getting his vagina to you? She is again.

    Yeah. An Amazonian goddess you are blessed to have had sex with. Would be thanking his lucky My god. Stars if he believes in. He looks like oh my god.

    This is in my notes. Go on. He looks like an it's a small world doll brought to life. Oh, no. And I stand by that.

    Oh my god. I need to find him. I'm gonna look him up after this because if I lean forward, I might pee. So we're almost done. So things turned quickly, though, for Jade because Corey, Massaro's other girlfriend that invited her to Ecuador Uh-huh.

    They were constantly competing for his attention, and, like, shit turned sour real quick. And Massaro loved this because he can, like, put them against each other Yes. He loves it. For more control over, like, his, like, time and approval. So he approved all of her social media posts.

    He wanted to use her to rope in another influencer named Alexis Ren. I guess Jade knew her sister, and he only allowed her to read approved books. So he was, like, very much controlling, like, all bullshit. What the fuck age? I know.

    That's but really, this is a trigger warning for sexual assault, but at a house party, he asked her to take off her top. What is it with take off your shirt? I don't know. But he oh, no. Sorry.

    He asked her to take all her clothes off Oh. While he's lecturing about masculinity. And she says that her stomach dropped, but she didn't wanna fuck up. So she's like, okay. He's so enlightened.

    This is him teaching me something. So she does it. She's told to sit on his lap, and he's, like, smoking a stogie, and is like, see, this is what masculinity is. And then touched her body Ew. And then asked her to do a handstand.

    Stand. He wanted upside down titties? Yeah. That's so fucking disgusting. Disgust.

    Like, it's all at his own pleasure. Like, it's for his, like, like, to make it, like, his what is it called? Entertainment. I don't know. I fucking hate him.

    Stupid. I didn't even even just like her, she describes it on a podcast, and, like, even leading up to it, I knew where it was going, and I was like, motherfucker. I hate him. So so Jade so she's so Jade is He's literally, like, jump. Yeah.

    And they're like because they're like, this guy's, like Yay. Better than Jesus. Yay. And, like, she's constantly told to ignore her bound like, the boundaries of Literally especially of sexual consent. Everything is a It's a chain.

    Chain. Yes. And so she's ignoring her boundaries, and she's doubting herself. So she doesn't even consider this, like, sexual assault at the time. Ugh.

    And so she then is pushed to the outer edge of the inner circle by a new girlfriend and is invited to teach meditation at the Eslin Institute, which is, like, a big deal if you're a yoga teacher. Like, you are creme of the crop Oh. If you're asked to go teach here. And he's, like, no. You can't go.

    Ew. And it's not until she's, like, I'm gonna promote your teachings that he was, like, yeah. No. I I think you can go there now. So then she goes, and she also comes across the vow.

    Yes, bitch. And it takes her a little bit longer, but soon she's, like, holy shit. What the fuck? Because I think at first she was, like, I would never have sex with Keith Raniere. Why would this happen?

    And then And she's like she notices the behaviors, and then she's like, oh my god. Oh, yes. I mean, I think that, again, he looks like an it's a small world doll brought to life, but he's he's miles higher than Keith Raniere. Okay. Okay.

    So in February, 2022, Jade, Jackie, and fellow ex member, Caitlin McNeil, they reach out to Sarah Edmonson, burn it down, Sarah. Yeah. And speak speak out on her podcast a little bit, Colty, with the goal to put it out there to warn others before it gets to, like, Nexium level. Oh my god. I love this so much.

    During COVID so I'll backtrack a little bit pre the vow or around the time of the vow. So Massaro does what someone on the fringes of society who hates mainstream media does during COVID, and he gets weird. Mhmm. He jumps on the conspiracy conspiracy bandwagon of David Ike, like, Guru Jaga, and he refers he refers to the coronavirus as a ruse What? To encourage people to quit their jobs over max vaccine mandate.

    Oh, he encourages people to quit their jobs over mac vaccine mandates and starts posting some, like, weird ass white privilege shit. Like, in 2020 June 2020, he posted a picture of himself gazing into the distance, And it said the caption says, quote, if you truly want what's best for you, don't linger in blaming your oppressors. That's not true courage. Thank them for showing you your weakness where you agreed to not love yourself and then change accordingly. And then he says that has nothing to do with race, but it was, like, it was peak BLM.

    Yeah. It was peak So Peak. Peak. Peak. BLM.

    George Floyd. Yes. Don't blame your oppressors. That's not true courage. Oh my god.

    This guy's still at it. He has a ton of online programs that he's peddling. Still sucks hard is what I wrote in my notes. Yes. Because it's true.

    Oh, and I also the last thing I wanted to say, if someone is claiming it to be a teacher and they're talking in circles and you don't understand, that's not a teacher you should be following. Yeah. Heller. Yeah. It's he's just doing a mental circle jerk.

    Mental circle jerk. Mental Didn't we have another episode called something about a circle jerk? No. It was the one taste because they actually were circle jerking. No.

    That's right. I'll restly back to circle jerk. It always leads back to a circle jerk. It does. Honestly, I'm gonna I'm gonna call this one.

    All roads lead back to a circle jerk. All roads lead back to circle jerk audacity. The audacity? The audacity of the mental circle jerk. Circle jerk.

    Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We that's it.

    That's it. That's it. That's it. We didn't have to think that hard. No.

    No. Oh, my god. He fucking sucks. He fucking sucks. And he's still, like, out there.

    And, like, all of his still again. And, ladies, I don't give a fuck if you're in a cult, if you're just if a man asks you to take your top off, don't fucking listen. No. It's fucking weird. It's fucking weird.

    And, again, it's only, like, it's for like, you might be thinking statement. Even if you're, like free with your body, if a guy asks you to do it, you say, fuck no. Because you I wanna do it. I wanna I do it when I want. You know what?

    I wanted to take my top off. But now when I don't who asked me to? Fuck you. Yeah. I'm not gonna.

    I would have done it if you just waited waited 20 minutes. Just 2 seconds ago, I was like, I might take my top off and then you asked me and now it's a hard no. Ass. That's exactly the right sentiment all the time. Yeah.

    If we teach our daughters anything, it's that. It's that. You take your top off when you want to. Yeah. Someone asks you, even if you still want to, you don't bump it.

    Do them. Yeah. You don't do it, and you wait till they're gone. Show everyone else and say, that's what he get. That's what he yep.

    That's what he's missing out on because he asked. Because he asked. I don't work for nobody. Yeah. I don't do nothing for nobody but myself.

    Sorry. I'm feeling like this is gonna I'm like you know how many times I've told my kids, I don't work for you. I don't work for you. I don't work for you. You can make me own pizza, bitch.

    I don't say that part, but the first part I do. Just not the bitch. I don't do anything because anybody asks me. Silently. I say, I mean, you make your own pizza.

    Bitch. Bitch. I said Are they I said So they I looked into the eyes of the back of his head slash soul, and I said, We we watched out with Feifei, and she could not stop. No. No.

    No. You were. Baby, was I drinking? We watched we it was, like, the first episode of Key and Peele, and she was like, oh, what is this? It is But she recognized them as the voices from Toy Story.

    What? She was, like, oh, no. She recognized them from Wendell and Wild. Oh, I was actually They're, like, oh, this is Wendell. They are in Toy Story.

    Oh, god. Or Yeah. They're in Toy Story. Oh. I didn't I don't think I've seen is that the one where they go into the burner thing?

    No. That's 3. Mhmm. Yeah. I've never I've never gone into 4.

    You you don't have enough tears you don't have enough tears in your body. Okay. So see, this is why. That is why. Because I'm I'm so emotionally unstable already, and I cannot be encouraged to cry.

    I will be dead for, like, a week. That's a really good point. Is it cathartic cry? It's just like a Is it happy cry sad cry? It's happy cry?

    Yeah. Of course, it's a happy cry. Well, I don't know. When they were going into the burners, I was sad crying. So it was, like, weird.

    I'm like, oh, this one is like torture. You know? It was like I was in my head saying bye to each and every single one of those toys when they were going into the burner. I didn't cry. I have a hard time crying this.

    You know what? The Lexapro? No. I just am not a cry. I'm not a movie cryer though.

    Oh, I cry for everything. I know. I do. I think I have, like, a lot of I'm very aware that it is a production of some sort, so it's very hard. Yeah.

    I'm a crier. I was just randomly thinking. I watched something where there was, like, an a gratuitous, like, some gratuitous violence that didn't, like, add anything. And in my mind, I was, like, that was $5,000 you could have put somewhere else. Okay.

    You're, like, literally, like, production what you're, like, God, that must have caused this. This must have caused this. I was like, why would you have done that? You wasted your fucking money. Yeah.

    That didn't make this movie better. You helped me understand your thought process. I know. Like Why why can't I enjoy it? Nobody asked me.

    Yeah. If someone would have consulted me, I would have said, you probably should lose that. It's not possible. Right? God.

    Yeah. If only. Why am I like this? We're better than Jesus. I can't.

    I'm kidding. I am better than Jesus. We are better than Jesus. So No. Maybe they should.

    Production. So next time they're at Oscars. Hey. Jesus. Hey.

    It's me. You think they're I think they're gonna be thanking you. Yeah. They should. Every time they throw something in the air, I'm gonna catch it and redirect it and throw it at you.

    Intercepting. Intercepting, bitch. Okay. Done. Touch back.

    Touch back over here. Too many I don't know anymore sports. Sports. Go sports. Go sports.

    And oh my god. We're an hour 30. We're it's gonna be an heavily edited. Heavily edited. So fun.

    It's good to be back. Yeah. Yeah. We'll see you next week. Alright, guys.

    Thanks for listening. Oh, wait. I'm Jess. Oh, and Jenna. Fuck.

    We fucked that up every single time. It's been like the last 10 episodes. Literally, the last every episode. Every episode, no one knows who we are. No.

    It's fine. It's fine. It's fine. Everything. It's fine.

    All things good. We're fine. Okay. Alright. Thanks.

Jenna Gurka
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